Chris Fletcher: The Tennessee Taster's line speaks to the capability of what we can do here in Lynchburg and what makes us unique in the world of whiskey.
Lucas Hendrickson: Whiskey making, when done right, is all about the process of capturing time in a barrel, then a bottle, but that doesn't mean there's not room to play around with that process from time to time. On this episode we talk with Jack Daniel's Assistant Master Distiller Chris Fletcher about how this iconic brand continues to innovate well into its second century, the ongoing and important work of the distillery's Master Taster's panel, and how trusting that process leads to new discoveries Around the Barrel.
Welcome back to Around the Barrel, the official podcast from the makers of Jack Daniel's. I'm your host, Lucas Hendrickson. Chris Fletcher probably stopped counting how many people tell him he has the greatest job in the world a long time ago. As the Assistant Master Distiller for Jack Daniel's, he's part of a team charged with making sure every drop of Jack Daniel's Old Number 7 Tennessee Whiskey and the various other brands that spin off from that famous liquid meets the highest quality standards. Chris' days are not just about the final product that resides in the iconic square bottle though, his work touches every part of the process that gets Jack Daniel's to friends all over the world, but he also understands the changing landscape of the whiskey world and the innovation that needs to be part of that. Even for a hundred fifty year old plus company. We talked with Chris about that innovation, the chance to take whiskey that might otherwise have been lost and turn it into something unique and spectacular, and how the idea of reunions have brought about a whole new set of special products honoring the spirit of Jack Daniels' home state.
Chris: Hey, this is Chris Fletcher. The Assistant Master Distiller at the Jack Daniel Distillery.
Lucas: Chris Fletcher. Welcome back to Around the Barrel.
Chris: Thank you. Good to be here.
Lucas: Last time you were with us, we kind of tried to dig in a little deep and see what was new and different on the horizon, as far as new Jack brands, you were a little dodge and weave there, but clearly we've got we got some news and got some new things that have been coming down the path in the latter half of 2018. Today we're talking about the Tennessee Taster's selection. Tell us a little bit about the origin of it, how did this idea of pulling really limited edition specialty whiskeys into the Jack umbrella?
Chris: Sure. Well, it's a couple different things that play into that, and we have a team of people that contribute to innovation here, Jeff and myself and several others that have a lot of input, and we were looking at what would be something that we could maybe give the people that would come to the distillery, Lynchburg is not easy place to find, You're not just driving past Lynchburg, right? You're trying to find it.
Lucas: You're coming here on purpose.
Chris: Exactly. And so we thought about you know, if there was a way to offer some stuff to you know, you can't get this really anywhere but here. Now, we do make it available through the State of Tennessee. So it is out there in the state, but the majority of it is probably here at our gift shop in the Visitor Center. And so we thought it would be nice to be able to create these small limited batches to reward them for finding Lynchburg. You know, you meet people, or I do from all over the world, and they say, "Hey we're planning a trip to the U.S. next year and we're going to go to New York. We're going to go to Las Vegas, and we're coming to Lynchburg." And so that's pretty powerful and I think it's almost like you feel responsible to have something unique and special that they can pick up at the gift shop. So that's one piece of it, you know, honestly, I would think on the whiskey making side of it, which is you know really where my focus is, is just to have some fun really and see what we can do with our capability and our process. And I think that's what makes Jack Daniel's so unique from a whiskey production standpoint is how we could control each part of the process, you know, Jeff and I probably get too much credit. We have a lot of people at every step of the way from incoming grain and our men and women in the distillery and our whiskey makers, and all the way through, you know, warehousing and our people getting the barrels in and out, and specific warehouse locations. And you know, there's so many people all the way along, all the way through bottling, you know, and getting the whiskey prepared for bottling, making sure it's clear, you don't have any any chunks of barrel floating around in there, and getting it into the bottle, you know, in the highest quality way. So if you look at that and our capability of owning the process, making our own barrels, you know and distillery operations, charcoal mellowing and we've got so much capability to create unique things, and that I think is exactly what these products get to the Tennessee Taster's line speaks to the capability of what we can do here in Lynchburg and what makes us unique in the world of whiskey, not only within Tennessee whiskey not only within American whiskey but within the world of whiskey, the way we control our process and can create products is really unmatched.
Lucas: Sure, and that gets more and more fascinating as we continue to dive into the unique capabilities of this company. Controlling it all from start to finish, from grain to glass has been said many many times, this series it seems to be really honoring the ability and the capabilities of the Master Taster panel. Tell us about how that group got together initially, what it consists of these days, and then where each of those folks kind of started to touch what this has now become?
Chris: Well, the Master Taster panel really was created before my time here at the distillery, you know, even though I've been running around here since I was a kid, there was a time that I wasn't around as much, and so if you go back to around 1997 with the creation of the Jack Daniel's Single Barrel product, Single Barrel select where you're basically hand-selecting individual barrels to be a standalone batch, and so that's when you want to call on your more experienced tasters. And so the Master Taster's panel, you know, there's sometimes people coming on and coming off of that panel and things so it's really a way to tell the story of how we're making our whiskey through the taster, and of course, all of our tasters are important here, certainly the Master Tasters with the approval process of Single Barrel whiskeys is something that you know, it is a source of pride to be a part of that that panel, but we've got a lot of great tasters and with the creation of these unique products, and quite honestly there's a lot of experimentation that goes along with it, and to be able to allow the story to be told through each unique taster here at the at the distillery, you know, our second one is coming out here in the next week or so for the barbecue, and we've got the Hickory Stave finish on that to where we literally took, you know, 20 staves of charred hickory wood, inserted it down through the bunghole of the barrel, sealed that barrel back up, back into the rick to age all summer long with those hickory staves in there, and then Marsha Hail, Marsha has been working at the distillery for years. I'm not even exactly sure how long, as long as I can remember, Marsha has been here. Her dad has also worked here for many many years, you know, she's been a taster as well. And so she also happens to be a competitive barbecue cooker, so she and her husband John who also works here at the distillery, they travel the country and they're cooking professionally, you know in these competitions, and Jeff and I kind of cornered her in the office one morning and said "Hey Marsha, we got an idea for the barbecue," and you know what a cool story to have you know, an everyday employee here at the distillery, a whiskey taster with her family history here in Lynchburg, and then to also be a professional barbecue competitor, and so it's really, really cool on that one, and so each expression we're going to you know, work with our tasters, with our whole group of tasters, and hopefully put together a product that they're really proud of, that Jack would be really proud of, and that people that can get their hands on a bottle are going to enjoy.
Lucas: Sure. As far as the Tennessee Taster's selection stuff, in the description, and sadly, I've not been able to taste it yet, but hopefully that will be soon. Of the one that you shepherded, the Angel's Share, High Angel's Share barrels. Talk about how that idea folded into what this is, was it kind of the, was it one of the genesis points of all this and in reading the description of it, it feels like this is kind of the "All the parts of the cow" kind of thing where these were these barrels had lost a tremendous amount of their yield but yet still flavorful enough to want to kind of create a special limited offering with it. Walk us through the creation of the High Angel's Share.
Chris: Sure. We started kicking these ideas around, you know, many months ago, a year ago, maybe even longer, but in whiskey whiskey terms that's not long at all.
Lucas: Just a drop in the bucket...or barrel.
Chris: That means you have to have things that you feel really good about already in the barrel. And so one of the things that that we had discussed with our innovation team, and Jeff and I and some of our R&D members and a few others, one of the things that kept coming back up as an interesting idea was was an idea of kind of a broken barrel or a barrel that was leaky or High Angel's Share as we obviously refer to here with the evaporation of the barrel evaporating up to the heavens, and the more we talked about it the more interesting that became and we felt like people would really, number one it's an easy concept to understand, High Angel's Share, more evaporation, more loss. But what does that do to the whiskey that's left behind? So it's kind of like this we call it "Distillers Privilege" like you know, sure Jeff and I could go find some barrels that had really small amounts of whiskey left in it, and we would be able to taste it but not many other people get that chance. And so the more that idea was talked about the more just interested I think we all got, and what would that be? And if I look back on it, you know Jeff and I had been looking at a Lot and when I say a Lot, that's a day's production, so a Lot number for us would be basically today is October 16th. And so every barrel from today, we would identify that going forward as a Lot. So this October 16th 2018. So we happened to be sampling some barrels in a barrel house, and you know, I guess really a lot of this is luck, because we drilled a few barrels that were just completely empty. We were up on the top floor of one of our barrel houses. And you know, we were we were drilling into barrels I drilled into at least one, I think Jeff drilled into two that were complete losses. So they are what we call a casualty barrel, and it was right around the time this innovation group was talking about this idea of a leaky barrel or you know, what flavors would be left behind if we really lost a lot of whiskey and we thought "Well, heck we got a lot of these barrels apparently." Which is unusual, I don't want people to think that's a normal thing. So this perfect storm kind of got created, we happened to find some barrels that that that we felt like we were losing a lot to the angels. And so, you know, we met with our warehousing team, got together and identified specific barrels that we knew had evaporated excessively, and so if you look I believe the number was 295 pounds, and that is handwritten I believe on every single label of this first offering, on the back side of the label, we wrote in 295 pounds. That was the ending weight, on an average, of all barrels that went into this batch. I don't know, 50 or so barrels.
Lucas: And they start at what weight, as they go into the barrelhouses?
Chris: 500.
Lucas: 500, So that's 40% loss there if I'm doing the math right.
Chris: Every bit of it, and you have to remember too, of that weight about a hundred pounds is barrel, okay, so you know, there's a little over 400 pounds of whiskey in there, and so we were left really with only maybe 190, 195 pounds of whiskey. So yeah, it should be a solid 50%.
Lucas: But then what then compelled you to move forward and kind of take what was left in those barrels and how do the flavor profiles differ? How do they change? How do they even from not only from Old Number 7 but also from the Single Barrel Select, what was the end result that then you went "Let's put this in a bottle and let folks try it?"
Chris: Well this batch is going to be more Single Barrel-esque in flavor, just because of that amount of evaporation which is going to lead to concentration of barrel extracts and things, that is going to probably lead people down that line of similar Single Barrel flavor, now that being said, this is roughly I don't remember the exact number of barrels, but just say about 50 barrels went into this, so you know, obviously each barrel is going to taste the same, each bottle, excuse me, is going to taste the same.
Lucas: So it's a blend off those 50 barrels.
Chris: Yeah, it's a mix, it's a mix of those 50. So you will have consistency from bottle to bottle, you don't get that necessarily from a Single Barrel, but that coupled with the hundred and seven proof, which is one of the things that I really am excited about to offer, a 107 Jack Daniel's product, 107 is kind of a classic American Whiskey proof point, you know, there's some history there with different whiskeys at 107. Obviously, you know with the seven coming in there, it has a good ring to it.
Lucas: We like the number 7 around here
Chris: Right? And so I think that and I really wanted people to enjoy the impact of this High Angel's Share, this High Loss and so the higher the proof, you know, you're going to experience that. Sure, you could have gone to a full-on barrel strength, but I think at 107 you get tons of flavor, Obviously, high-proof whiskey 107 but yet you can enjoy it and sip on it neat. It speaks to the quality of what we do. It's not going to really burn it's going to be nice and warm, you're going to get some spice, but it's not going to just overwhelm you and so I really wanted people to be able to sit down just you know, pour a couple fingers in a glass just sip on that nice and slow get the full flavor experience, you know and be able to enjoy it at an elevated proof point.
Lucas: That's awesome. So, High Angel's Share, and then the Smoked Hickory and then the other one that has been announced is the Reunion Barrel. Talk a little bit about what that's going to emerge as in early 2019.
Chris: Yeah, excited about that one as well. We're at a really good point and the Reunion Barrel, and Jeff is really championed that one, especially, it's really exciting with some of his contacts and friends that he has across the industry. We were talking about barrel finishing and barrel finishing is done a lot in whiskey, right? Globally. It's done all over the world. I think when you look at barrel finishing and you look at what we do at Jack Daniel's, one of the things especially with this Tennessee Tasters line, you know, we want each expression, hopefully, to be really unique and really have a great story behind it. You know, we're tying it, we're putting a taster's name on every single release and it's really important for us, you know to have everything come together for these products. We want it to be really an experience. You can only get it here at the distillery or in Tennessee, and so if you think about barrel finishing, well, it's not that hard right to find a barrel from somewhere else, put your stuff in it, that's done every day. And absolutely, you know, some people may take barrels of whiskey from one place and put it in another barrel from a different place and then, you know, put their name on it and move it forward and I just didn't feel really great about that, you know, something like I felt like it's just too easy. You know, we're capable of more and so out of this conversation with our innovation team, you know, it was it was more of a case of how do we do that in a way that we feel really good about it being done in the way that Jack Daniel would be proud, and the way we can control here in Lynchburg. And that's where the idea of this kind of homecoming reunion type of scenario came up and the thought is since we're making our own barrels, you know, we're out there harvesting trees. Contracting with loggers and we're buying these logs into our stave mills, and our own people, our own employees are cutting these trees down into staves. Our own employees are making the barrels out of these staves. We're toasting, were charring, you know again back to the whole control thing, how do we take that dedication and then apply it to a barrel finished product? And so that's where the thought was. Look, let's make sure if we're going to finish in a barrel that it's a barrel that we created, so the genesis of this barrel lies with our own hands. Right, we create it. We use it for what we need for our Tennessee whiskey, it goes out into the world and it could go anywhere and we have barrels that go almost everywhere. It's absolutely and so this one it just so happened that Tennessee Winery which does you know, very nice red wine in our Jack Daniel's barrels once we've used them. We luckily had good timing and they were getting ready to cycle through some barrels that they were finished with, and we were able to send the truck up and some of our guys they loaded those barrels up on one of our trucks. We brought them home and we refilled then fully aged Jack Daniel's back into these barrels to sit and finish, and so they're going to be in those barrels probably, you know, definitely over six months I'd say at this point, they're still going right now, that whiskey is still in the barrel right now. We really really like the direction it's headed and tI do think for that kind of winter time frame, you're going to get some really unique flavors out of that. It's really when you think about wine and whiskey I think I was surprised when I saw it some of the kind of rich almost buttery almost, you know, like a confectionery note that comes out into the whiskey. It's really surprising.
Lucas: That sounds delicious and I can't wait to try some actually when it hits an early next year. So what are the other kinds of things that are on the horizon as far as this taster's group line. These are the first three, how many more do you have scheduled?
Chris: Well, we're working on it and that you know that then comes the hard part, you know, it's easy to do one or two, right but I really want to keep this this going. I think people are really interested in trying new things. And I think it's an opportunity for people to learn more about what we do at Jack Daniel's and about our process and to understand an idea like the Reunion Barrel and and how that barrel came home. And oh, wow, you know, they made the barrel and they use the barrel and then it came back and so I think all these stories you know that are so unique to what we do in Lynchburg is such a great thing to share with people through this product. And you know we'll continue to investigate, you know, maturation opportunities, you know we'll continue to investigate what can we do with the barrel, what can we do with unique barrel houses, you know, what can we do within the distillery tours to create different expressions of whiskeys. So honestly, we're wide open, if you have any ideas, I'm all ears.
Lucas: I'm much better with the final expressions, I'm a much better consumer than I am a creator as I will say, but again from any sort of creative activity once you know the rules then you can learn how to break them creatively and and get you know, that those next iterations and generations of whatever it is you're trying to do, you know, this is a hundred and fifty-three soon year old company and a globally known brand name, but at the same time that this opportunity to take and add these new spins on it, while also honoring what you do every day, it's got to feel really good.
Chris: Yeah. It really does. It's a really special thing to be able to create something new and with the current state of American whiskey and consumers, you know wanting to know where whiskey is made, they want to know who is making it, they want to know how it's made and they want to know the quality to it and it couldn't be better, for what we do at Jack Daniel's, because again our level of control and how we do things here, its unmatched in every bottle of Old Number 7, absolutely, but we also have the capability to tell that story of whiskey making through other products as well, and so it really is one of the most exciting things that I get to do in my role with Jeff with our innovation team to sit down and brainstorm about how we're going to create a brand new whiskey. That's really fun.
Lucas: And it's encouraging to know, encouraging for whiskey fans all over the world, to know that again a company that is this far along in the cycle and this interesting, this capable, is still nimble enough to do those things, recognizing that you know, these markets have changed dramatically over the past decade plus and that innovation is kind of called for in a lot of ways, you see things that that the company has made in the wake of other products hitting the market but Jack Daniel's does it better. And does it you know, first mover doesn't always necessarily mean that it's going to be the best and you look at what has been done Tennessee Honey and Tennessee Fire and and other, obviously you look at the Single Barrel select stuff. It always just seems to elevate that excellence when those products finally hit the market and the ability to continue to innovate like this just maintains the long-term viability of this brand.
Chris: Yeah, I couldn't say it much better than that I guess, you know, we're very fortunate, you know, we've had a lot of success and we've been able to reinvest that success into our process and to also be very thoughtful with how we innovate and you're right, we're usually not the first one to the party, but I do think being thoughtful and being true to what we do here in Lynchburg, there's a lot of importance with that, you know, I think about you know, when my granddad was here, '50s, '60s, '70s, '80s, Old Number 7 was allocated most of his career. Just go back to that time and think about it, Old Number 7, basically the only thing we made, the only label of Jack rolling out the door pretty much, and it was on an allotment system in every state in the country until about 1980. And so you think about the expansion and the growth and you talk about innovation, how about adding a still right next to the one that you're running at the same time? Or you're building a new barrel house every six weeks. That's innovation. I mean, it may not be a new product, but the demand that they had back at that time to do it every day and to grow it and to not only grow it, to make sure that it stayed the same. So, you know, that's something else that we still balance today. You know, we fortunately we've got a lot of fans of Old Number 7 out there, a lot of friends all over the world and we're going to continue to be committed to that first, and then you know innovation after that, we have to make sure that we do it in a way that we feel like it does Old Number 7 proud, right? And that's the way I approach it. That's the way I look at it.
Lucas: And that's what people can perhaps tend to forget in seeing things that are innovative that it's not always about the final product, in fact it's rarely about the final product. It's about the process and getting there, and then when you have this requirement, this command, this ideal that has been set over these decades and if not centuries, you know to make sure that those things all fall in line with what you have been doing, what you will be doing, what you will continue to be doing, as well as adding to the list of new things putting on there. That's really where these stories just become fascinating, and so glad to see this first wave of these Tennessee Taster's come out and really looking forward to seeing what's going to come along the way so Chris, Thanks again for letting us come to see you Around the Barrel.
Chris: Yeah. Absolutely, any time.
Lucas: Around the Barrel is the official podcast of the Jack Daniel Distillery. Follow the podcast on the web at JackDaniels.com/podcast. If you like what you hear, please subscribe, rate, and review at Apple Podcasts or wherever you gather your on-demand audio. Always remember, with great podcast and great whiskey, please enjoy responsibly. Join us next time for more conversations Around the Barrel. Your friends at Jack Daniel's remind you to drink responsibly. Jack Daniel's and Old Number 7 are registered trademarks, copyright 2018, Jack Daniel's Tennessee Whiskey, 40% alcohol by volume, 80 proof, distilled and bottled by Jack Daniel Distillery, Lynchburg, Tennessee. Around the Barrel is intended for listeners 21 years of age and older.
