Around the Barrel - Transcript: Ep030 Nelson Eddy and Charlie Pignone

 

Nelson Eddy: You know, Sinatra's doing concerts around the world in the ‘50s, and from the stage he's saying, “Jack Daniel’s, the nectar of the gods.”

 

Frank Sinatra: And I drink Jack Daniel’s at night and everything’s the same, right? That’s the nectar of the gods, baby. Lynchburg, Tennessee that comes from, where the water tastes like cherry wine. Well, I come from New Jersey. The water tastes like turpentine.

 

Nelson: It's no mystery why in 1955 sales are up 100 percent for Jack Daniel’s, which is a real problem because, you know, you have to make this stuff up and put it into a barrel house and let it mature.

 

Lucas Hendrickson: We've all gotten pretty comfortable, maybe a little too much so in some cases, with the term “influencer” these days, public figures for whom the very mention much less patronage of a product can send their fan bases scurrying to acquire it. In the specific case of Jack Daniel’s Old No. 7 Tennessee Whiskey, Frank Sinatra was very much an influencer.

 

On this episode, we talk with Charlie Pignone, the president of Frank Sinatra Enterprises, and Nelson Eddy, our favorite Jack Daniel's historian, about the outsized role Ol’ Blue Eyes had in popularizing Old No. 7, how the spirit went with him around this world and into the next one and how him speaking about it from the stage sent the folks in Lynchburg into overdrive Around the Barrel.

 

Welcome back to Around the Barrel, the official podcast from the makers of Jack Daniel’s. I'm your host, Lucas Hendrickson.

 

When you talk about the world of 20th century show business, the phrase “triple threat” gets brought up a lot. It reaches back to the Broadway era and someone who can sing, dance and act at the highest level.  We'll leave it to others to judge his hoofing abilities, but when it came to every other aspect of entertaining, Frank Sinatra was a threat in all of them. Sinatra emerged as the preeminent pop music singer, not only of his, but also several subsequent generations.

 

He was a gifted actor, picking up three Academy Awards across 16 films, and he dazzled audiences on television, and more intimately, on concert stages around the globe. His style, his talent, his presence established him as a true tastemaker across so many aspects of popular culture up to and very much including how he chose to wet his whistle while on stage.

 

Charlie Pignone got to witness the Chairman of the Board's unique charisma up close for decades as part of his marketing and production team and continues to shepherd Sinatra's legacy as the president of Frank Sinatra Enterprises.

 

Charlie knows the stories, having seen them in person or scoured through hours of tape from concerts captured around the world. And in so many of those stories and in the crooner’s own words, we can see exactly how to enjoy Jack Daniel’s Frank's way.

 

Charlie Pignone: I'm Charlie Pignone, and I'm the president of Frank Sinatra Enterprises. I'm originally from New York, but I now reside in California.

 

Nelson: Hello, I'm Nelson Eddy. I'm the Jack Daniel’s historian. I was born in Shirley, Massachusetts but currently reside in Murfreesboro, Tennessee.

 

Lucas: Charlie Pignone, Nelson Eddy, welcome to Around the Barrel.

 

Charlie: Thank you.

 

Nelson: Good to be here.

 

Lucas: Nelson, you've been with us a few times before talking about a lot of different kinds of things as it relates to the world of Jack Daniel’s.

 

Charlie, this is your first time with us, but in the years that we've been doing this show and obviously the years kind of leading up to my exposure to the brand as I've been around it being a Nashville resident for the better part of three decades, Frank Sinatra has loomed large, you know, in the history, in the lore, in the legend of Jack Daniel’s.  Charlie, give us a little context about how Frank came to know – well, pardon me – Mr. Sinatra came to know about Jack Daniel’s and his role in kind of popularizing it in the ‘40s, ‘50s and beyond.

 

Charlie: Yeah. Well, there's been a lot of conjecture, but let's get it right from the horse's mouth. I mean, stories have abound in books and people talking that it was Jackie Gleason that introduced Frank to Jack Daniel’s. That's not true.

 

Lucas: Oh. Okay.

 

Charlie: Frank actually was introduced – in fact, I just pulled out an audio of a concert from 1982, and Frank told the story. And he said legendary actor Humphrey Bogart introduced him to Jack Daniel’s in the early ‘50s at a dinner party at Bogart’s house, and after that Frank was hooked. And Frank became a huge fan of Jack Daniel’s. I think he helped expose the brand starting in that mid ‘50s era because he continued to drink and promote it during his performances for over 40 years. He was really a great unpaid spokesperson for it.  But the main thing is that his love for the brand was authentic, and I think people gravitate to that and they realize how much he really enjoyed it. He just wasn't shilling as a marketing thing. I mean, he was an unpaid spokesman for decades.

 

 
Lucas: Sure.

 

Charlie: The other key to this relationship was Frank had befriended Angelo Lucchesi, and Nelson can tell you more about Angelo. I believe he was one of the first salesmen for Brown-Forman, but Frank and Angelo had a friendship that lasted for five decades.

 

And Angelo would ship Jack Daniel’s wherever Frank wanted it, because in the early years when he was touring outside of the United States, Frank wouldn't leave or he would always travel with his own supply. And speaking of Nashville, Angelo was also instrumental in arranging for Frank to do a performance at the Grand Ole Opry on May 10th, 1976. They were great friends. I met Angelo through Frank, because in the later years of Frank's career, Angelo would attend concerts.

 

And he would also – Frank had a golf tournament out in Palm Springs. And the money that they raised for that was to build a child abuse center at the Eisenhower Hospital. And so I got to know Angelo over the decades through his friendship with Frank. And that's how it all began. But it's an authentic relationship. And Frank actually loved and drank Jack Daniel’s.

 

Lucas: Nelson, can you give us a little more of a sense of who Angelo Lucchesi was and his role not only just with Frank Sinatra, but also just in helping to popularize the brand around the country?

 

Nelson: Sure. First of all, I want to say thank you, Charlie. You know, it's great when the historian can come on and learn something. We have helped propagate that Gleason story. It's widely distributed, but it makes total sense that it would be Humphrey Bogart.

 

We know Bogart was a big Jack Daniel's fan, as was Lauren Bacall, and it was the fuel of that original Rat Pack. And then later, you know, Sinatra with his own Rat Pack and Sammy Davis Jr., although Sammy drank his mixed with coke, and I think Frank objected to that.

 

Charlie: Yes. And I had a feeling that – because I know through all the years when we put out press releases, because you know, Bill Zehme I think is the one that thought he had heard Frank talk about Jackie Gleason introducing it to him.

 

And then I'm sure – cause Frank hung out at Toots Shor’s in New York with it. But I actually transcribed and I'll read you what Frank said in March of 1982 at Caesar's Palace.

 

He picked up a glass of Jack Daniel's and said, “I was introduced to this drink by my great friend, a great man named Humphrey Bogart. He introduced me to Jack Daniel's one night after dinner at his house. He said to me, ‘Dago, what do you want to drink after dinner?’

 

And I said, ‘I don't know. I don't care.’ And he said, ‘All right. I'm going to introduce you to Jack Daniel's.’ And I said, ‘What the hell is Jack Daniel's?’ This is all true. He said, ‘Let me pour you some.’ And from then on, it was a happy marriage.”

 

That's Frank in 1982 onstage.

 

Nelson: Hey, I'm not going to argue with the Chairman of the Board. It does make a whole lot of sense. It does.

 

Charlie: Yeah. And I'm sure, like I said, there are some great stories about Frank at Toots Shor’s with Jackie Gleason and them drinking and hanging out, but it was from Frank's mouth. It was Bogart that introduced him to it.

 

Nelson: Well, that's really a better story. Because we were later shamed into making Lauren Bacall the first female Tennessee Squire. Somebody had called up the distillery, somebody associated with the Rat Pack and asked why Lauren Bacall wasn't a member of the Tennessee Squires.

 

And at that time, you know, it was largely a male – it was entirely a male dominated organization. And the caller said, “Lauren drinks more Jack Daniel's than Bogart does.” And so Lauren Bacall became our first female Tennessee Squire and began a tradition. We have many, many great Tennessee Squires both male and female.

 

Charlie: Oh, that's great. Well, it's always good to set the record straight. And, you know, with Frank, the career is so long and immense that when I listen to these concerts and a lot of his monologues, you can pick up a lot of stuff.  But the problem that we have with Frank is that a lot of people that have written books about him really never met him, and they're taking hearsay stuff. But this makes perfect sense because we all know that Bogart was a huge Jack Daniel's fan. Frank idolized Bogart, but then he fell in love with the brand himself.

 

Nelson: Yeah. Yeah.

 

Charlie: Wow.

 

Nelson: So, you had asked about Angelo.

 

Lucas: Angelo Lucchesi. But we’re rewriting history here. I'm okay with that happening too. Sure.

 

Nelson: I am too. You know, Angelo Lucchesi – Charlie, you're right – was the very first salesman for Jack Daniel's. He was a friend of the Motlows way before he came to work for Hap Motlow principally.

 

And he came to work as the first salesman and, you know, he is the only salesman we've ever had that ended up with his name on a bottle. And that's largely because of Frank Sinatra, who, we'll talk about I'm sure later, has his name on a bottle of Jack Daniel's.

 

But Angelo was a good Catholic. He'd go to mass. And here in Nashville, right next to the Baker Building that was the headquarters in those days of Jack Daniel's, right next door was the cathedral.

 

And so when Dan is going to mass – this is in 1967 – he gets a call. Well, actually, Mike Filio, a friend, you know, involved in the record industry there in Nashville and a friend of Angelo's – he would drive Angelo to mass. And Mike tells Angelo that he got a call from Uncle Jilly. And this call was that Frank was at the Copacabana and couldn't find any Jack Daniel's and certainly there was a good Italian down there with some clout to make this happen.

 

And Angelo says, “Mike, what am I going to do? I'm Italian, but I don't know about clout.” So, right after mass, he goes next door to the Baker Building and he finds Hap Motlow there. He brings it up with Hap. Hap says, “I don't know what we can do. Jack Daniel's is in extremely short supply. We don't have enough of it as it is. Why don't you talk to Winton Smith, the president of the company?”

 

Hap was a member of the Jack Daniel's family. Winton was the first non-member of the family to be president. And Winton listens. He's a huge Frank Sinatra fan, makes a couple of calls and he says, “It's taken care of.”

 

So Angelo leaves that day not knowing whether it's taken care of or not. He hopes it is. Well, he gets home and there's a call. His wife answers the phone, and she gives the phone to Angelo. And there's a voice on the other end of that phone call that just booms out, “Paesano, you're my friend for life.”

 

Angelo's taken back. It's Frank Sinatra calling him up. Frank will give him his personal phone numbers and, as Charlie's described it, there truly was a friendship there, which is neat because this is a brand built on friendship.  Bogart’s friendship with Frank Sinatra helps introduce Sinatra. Angelo Lucchesi didn't introduce Frank to Jack, but always would say, “I didn't introduce him, but I kept him on it and made sure there was always some Jack Daniel's available.”

 

Charlie: Yeah. Well, I have to just interject here that I think I met Angelo in the mid or late ‘80s, and just a wonderful human being. I mean, what a force of nature. He was missing his arm from a childhood accident.

 

And also in the later years when he would travel out here, he had such a spirit that – he was on dialysis, and he would come out here and he would visit us in California. And he would go to a local dialysis center. With everything that was against him, he had the best attitude. He was just a wonderful human being.

 

Lucas: Wow. So, Charlie, tell us a little bit more about your interaction with Mr. Sinatra. Where did you come into his world? And as president of Frank Sinatra Enterprises, what does that entail these days?

 

 
Charlie: Okay. Well, my relationship with Frank began in 1984. I became the president of the Sinatra Society of America. At that time, that was the largest Sinatra fan club in the United States. I was 18 years old at the time. And from about 1984 until Frank retired, I traveled the world with him. Probably saw about 400 or more performances of his over those years. You know, to those who never knew Frank personally, he was considered a wonderful singer and an entertainer.

 

But to those who did know him, he was a very loyal friend, sort of like we were talking about Angelo and Frank and someone who was there for you no matter what situation, time or day.

 

There's a great quote that says, “A successful life is not an easy life. It's built on strong qualities: sacrifice, integrity and loyalty.” And that sort of sums up Frank Sinatra to me. Anybody that was a friend with Frank Sinatra – he was legendary for his loyalty.

 

And then through that, when I graduated in 1988 from college, I was asked to travel with him in a marketing capacity. And it evolved to the point now where I'm the president of Frank Sinatra Enterprises, which is a business.

 

Frank Sinatra Enterprises is a company that was formed by the Sinatra family and the Warner Music Group about 15 years ago to manage and license the Sinatra business. That includes his name and likeness and his recordings.

 

And what we do is there is still a huge demand for his music. We still sell a lot of CDs, but as you mentioned prior to I think we came on the air, the streaming – we're amazed. Billions of streams a year.

 

Lucas: Sure.

 

Charlie: Frank still streams. And we also have a great business with synchronization.

 

Lucas: Of course.

 

Charlie: We get a lot of requests for Frank's music in movies, television and commercials worldwide. In fact, if anybody's seen the “Joker” last year, we had two songs in there: “That's Life” and “Send in the Clowns.”

 

But there's billions of streams a year. His music is heard on movies, television, and that exposes him to an entire new audience. So, I like to say with Frank Sinatra, there’s no generation gap, cause each new generation finds his music and they appreciate his artistry.

 

Lucas: Yeah. Why do you think, if we can even quantify why, that is? I mean, I certainly remember – and I'm in my early fifties. I'll just say that. I remember knowing about Frank Sinatra from a very early age through things like “The Tonight Show” and other television appearances, but also there was a movie career and a certainly a pop music career before all of that that exposed him to millions of people before the real popularization of popular music. What were those items that he possessed as an artist that helped make him universal to generations of fans?

 

Charlie: Yeah. I don't know what that X factor is except, for people not being able to see him live today, his music is still popular and resonates with all age groups.

 

Lucas: Sure.

 

 
Charlie: His appeal was and is, I think, that people felt he believed in what he was singing and his music touched and moved people like no one before, since when you hear his voice, it comforts people.

 

It reminds people of better times, of their family. And I think given the state the world is in today, I think we need his music more than ever. But you hit on something talking about his music career and his international appeal. While he was an American original, his influence and impact was felt worldwide. He was an international superstar. Starting in the ‘50s, he toured Europe, Australia, Japan, all over the world up until he retired. And besides being that musical icon, he had a very successful movie career. He made 60 movies and won three Academy Awards. So, when you add the recording, the live performances, radio, television, et cetera, it's an astounding body of work.

 

I don't see how anyone today could have that kind of career, because the attention span of people just comes and goes. But this is a man that started in the ‘30s and ended in the ‘90s, and whether you're a fan of his music or not, his impact on popular music and the world is undeniable. I feel he's still one of the most relevant singers of our time to even today.

 

Lucas: Sure. And you can't – there's no way you can kind of get around that simply because, as you said before, that lack of generation gap. It's a name that you just inherently know when you kind of do any sort of – not even a deep dive into the history of American popular music starting in the 20th century.

 

He just – he looms large, not only in the music business, but also in just general entertainment, movies, TV, all of those things. It's a fascinating career to look at that, you're right, could not possibly be duplicated today with our divided attention spans and so much stuff coming down the pike at us as far as pop culture goes.

 

Nelson: Yeah. He just – I mean, I'm always astounded when I do some archiving and just look at what he was doing in the ‘40s between live performances, movies, you know, radio and then with the advent of television. It’s just astounding, the energy that he had to do all this stuff.

 

I mean, don't forget in those days, originally before they had tape with radio, they would do those shows twice. They'd do an East Coast and West Coast show. So, essentially when he was doing a show in the ‘40s, he was actually doing two shows. It wasn't until they were able to actually tape or press records and then ship them. But yeah, it's – his career is astounding. I don't think anybody will ever come close to it just in terms of the breadth and depth of what he did.

 

Lucas: Sure. Jumping back into the world that we know a little bit better, in the whiskey universe, as Nelson mentioned, you know, one of the few people other than Mr. Jack himself to have his name on a particular expression.

 

Nelson, tell us a little bit about how that idea kind of came to fruition in 2013, I believe it was, with the first Sinatra specific bottle and then where we are with that project today.

 

Nelson: Yeah. Okay. A couple of things first though. Charlie really hit on some interesting things. You know, Sinatra's doing concerts around the world in the ‘50s. And from the stage he's saying, “Jack Daniel's, the nectar of the gods.”

 

And it's no mystery why in 1955 sales are up 100 percent for Jack Daniel's, which is a real problem because, you know, you have to make this stuff up and put it into a barrel house and let it mature.

 

So, to go up 100 percent – and at the time, we were selling right at 167 thousand cases of all of the labels. There were really three brands at the time. And all of a sudden it doubles in a year, and it took us till 1979 to catch up. And so if there's any single person – I mean, the name of Jack Daniel's is important. Lem Motlow and the Motlows are important. Nearest Green is an important name. But beyond that, the most important name in Jack Daniel's history has been Frank Sinatra.

 

I mean, literally took us 29 years or more. It took us a whole long to catch up to the sales that Frank created. You know, when you have that kind of an effect on a brand, we need to say thank you. And one of the ways to say thank you is to craft a really nice whiskey, Jack Daniel's Sinatra Select.

 

There are a million details, if you look at this bottle, that really go back – inspired by Frank Sinatra, from an emblem of his fedora on the cap and the color orange accents, which is a color that Frank enjoyed. Even the whiskey itself is inspired by Frank. It's smooth, bold and classic. And I think those three things could be said of Sinatra as well as the whiskey.

 

One of the interesting differences about this whiskey is we've created what we call “Sinatra barrels” because they're used in this product. And we double the surface area in this barrel, its exposure to the whiskey, by cutting grooves in the barrel. It's that additional exposure to the wood that makes the whiskey so bold. And again, we think that reflects on the style that Frank Sinatra had. It was actually introduced at Cannes in 2012 to travel retail but was more widely available in 2013.

 

Lucas: And then there was the Sinatra Century Expression that came out 2015.

 

Charlie: Yeah, that was 2015. Nelson was right. Frank Jr. actually – we flew to Cannes. He did a private performance. It really came into for the public to buy in 2013. And then in 2015, we released a limited edition Sinatra Century Package in honor of Frank's hundredth birthday. Both, as Nelson said, were created to honor the relationship between Frank and Jack. And I think they're ultra-premium expressions of what Frank loved in Jack Daniel's. The Sinatra Select box contained a booklet that has the story of Frank and the relationship between Frank and Jack Daniel's. And the Sinatra Century came in a real high end box. It was a limited release, this luxury gift box. And we included a previous unreleased concert of Sinatra at the Sands from Las Vegas on a USB drive. And the reason I did that was one of his top selling albums is Sinatra at the Sands from 1966. And in that, when you listen to his monologue, he must mention Jack Daniel's two or three times. And when they were doing that album, they had taped 12 shows of his to cobble together the album. But we actually found one complete show and that was put in the box to make it really special. And that – and Nelson would know better. I don't know how many cases that was, but I think it’s sold out. I do wish I had more of them, because I see some of those unopened on eBay at astronomical prices.

 

Lucas: I was going to ask you if people are still kind of trying to hunt those down after a half decade or so.

 

Charlie: Absolutely. It didn't just sell out. It evaporated.

 

Lucas: Which is usually a bad thing for whiskey somewhat. But in this case, it's actually kind of a good thing. So, I imagine for those of you hopefully listening to this who have a bottle and it's still unopened, enjoy looking at it. Taste it if you like, because that's part of the drill. But we've seen some of this in other aspects of pop culture, but it still even to this day feels like everything that he touched had this air of classiness and somewhat adventure and a high end feel to it that not only makes it desirable for collectors, but also for fans just to honor his creative output.

 

Charlie: Yeah. I think that, you know, we’re very lucky that the Sinatra children have been diligent in preserving their father's legacy.

 

Lucas: Yeah.

 

Charlie: We don't do a lot of licenses. And this is really authentic. You're hearing Nelson and I telling stories about the relationship here. This is not – and I'm not putting anybody down in today's day or media age, but this is not paying a spokesperson, a celebrity spokesperson, to do a voice or go on camera. This is authentic. And I think people gravitate towards authenticity today in brands and also in celebrities. Frank is not, like I said – and Nelson can tell you. Frank was never paid, but he would mention Jack – I can't tell you. I said I saw 400 concerts.  Every night on that stage, there was a guy that worked for the production manager that had to mix Frank's drink and put that on the piano right before the curtain went up. And Frank had that Jack Daniel's. And he toasted the audience every night, and I would say at least 90 percent of the time he would mention what he was drinking. There was one time I remember we put out a video in a box set called “Sinatra in Vegas.” And he picks up the Jack Daniel's and he realizes there's a liquor convention in town and all the people that night at the show are liquor salesmen. And he says, “I don't – you know what I'm drinking. I'm not going to say. I don't want to offend anybody in the room.” But yeah, that's “Sinatra in Vegas” on the box, but this man almost nightly, wherever he performed, would talk about Jack Daniel's.

 

Nelson: Such a loyal, loyal person. Loyal – here is a salesperson. Imagine this. This is a sales person. The company presidents, the vice presidents, all of the marketing people who would have loved to have had a relationship to Frank, with Frank Sinatra – they were all beholden to this elderly salesman who maintained that relationship. And it was their friendship and everybody – they stayed away from it and let that just be pure and authentic. And the other thing is Sinatra and his love of the brand still shapes our policy as a company today. Over the years, when there's been so many chances for sponsorships, what we really rely on is friendship because it's the most authentic, as you said, Charlie. It's real. And people have great BS detectors out there, and they know when something's genuine and the real deal and when it's not.

 

Lucas: There's no better way to kind of describe the ethos of Jack Daniel's that way. I mean, if you visit Lynchburg – and hopefully very soon people will be able to return. You have this era of authenticity about the whole operation. Everybody who works there is devoted to the mission of, you know, “Every day we make it, then we'll make it the best we can.” That idea runs through the entire company, from everybody who touches the product and puts it out into the world. So, the fact that someone of this caliber, this public a figure, reaches out and embraces that idea for so many decades, you know, it's pretty fascinating.

 

Charlie: Yeah. It's a wonderful tribute to the friendship and both legacies. My only regret is I remember speaking to Angelo and a group of people that had worked with Jack Daniel's probably in the late ‘80s, early ‘90s at one of the golf tournaments and saying, “Oh my god. We should do a Sinatra Jack Daniel's.” And I only lament that it was done after Frank passed, because I can imagine how Frank would have felt about it seeing his name on the bottle. I think it would have been fantastic. I can imagine him doing a commercial, which would have been wonderful. But Angelo was so proud when this happened. And next to Frank seeing it, I'm glad Angelo got to see the fruition that it got done, and it was just a happy marriage.

 

Nelson: So, Charlie, I got a question for you. Maybe you can clear something up for me. So, I want to be absolutely sure we have this right. How did Frank drink his Jack Daniel’s?

 

Lucas: You were heading in my exact direction there, Nelson.

 

Charlie: Yeah. I believe he would have two fingers on the rocks with a splash of water. I can tell you that he didn't like a lot of ice cubes in his drink. In fact, when I mentioned about the production people putting the glass on the piano and filling it up, sometimes they would overfill it with ice, figuring under the lights and the hotness of the stage it would melt. But I can tell you, many times Frank would take that glass, take a sip and if there was a lot of ice, put his hand in it, take the ice out and throw it on the stage and say something like, “Who do they think is here? Sonja Henie?” Sonja Henie was an ice skater. And a lot of people in the audience probably had no idea what Frank was talking about, but he was not happy if there was too much ice in his drink. But I always remember him saying he wanted two fingers on the rocks with a splash of water and not a lot of cubes.

 

Lucas: Did he have any other cocktails that he enjoyed outside of, you know, being on stage?

 

Charlie: When I was with him, besides Jack, I would occasionally see him drink a vodka martini. And sometimes, if it was an Italian dinner, some red wine with dinner. But I've got to say, when I was in his company, 90 percent of the time he was drinking Jack Daniel's onstage and off when he would be drinking.

 

Lucas: Gotcha. So, Charlie, if you were going to – you know, you probably have many times. If you were introducing Frank's music to somebody for the first time, are there three songs that you would point them to? Which songs do you think in 2020 are the most emblematic of his work, his art, his style?

 

Charlie: The fun thing about it is when people are exposed to his music and they hear it, they'll know if they like it or not. I would tell people, “Listen to this album, and if you don't get Frank Sinatra from listening to him, there's nothing I can tell you or say that's gonna make you appreciate him.” When I was in college and off for the breaks and would travel with Frank to Atlantic City or Las Vegas, a lot of the time college friends would come with me. And when they saw him, they were blown away. And then in those days they would start buying his CDs and listening to him. Frank had so many great songs, and he developed the concept album. So, if you're down, you know, there's an album like “Only the Lonely.” If you're in a happy mood, you know, there's “Come Fly with Me.” But I think in this day and age probably you can look – we benefit from hindsight with Spotify and these streaming service companies. We can look and see what streams the most. And you mentioned “Fly Me to the Moon,” but it's probably “My Way.”  There's another great song he did called “The Way You Look Tonight,” which I know a lot of people use in their weddings, but “My Way” for decades has been one of the most popular songs played at funerals. I mean, we get a list every year of the songs that are played at funerals. It would probably be “My Way,” “Strangers in the Night.”

 

Lucas: Sure.

 

Charlie: But the catalog is so immense. And like I said, he started recording commercially and with a label in the late ‘30s all the way up until the ‘90s, which, you know, those duets albums that he did in the mid early ‘90s were actually the biggest selling albums of his career. And they help people listen to him and then explore the catalog. I don't have a favorite because it all depends on the mood I'm in, but I'm saying, if I would direct somebody to listen to something, I would say “Come Fly With Me” or “I've Got You Under My Skin” if you want to hear Frank – “My Way,” “That's Life,” songs of affirmation, something like that. Or if you're in a sad mood, it would be “In the Wee Small Hours of the Morning” or “Only the Lonely” or “I Guess I’ll Hang My Tears Out to Dry.” Just such an immense catalog. And the great thing about it is digitally now is almost every – I mean, we constantly find things. And I will put unreleased tracks as bonuses on albums, but a majority, I would say 98 percent of what he recorded is there for people to listen to. And they could from 1939 until 1995. It's all up there.

 

Lucas: Sure. Charlie, tell us a little bit more, at least from a social media standpoint, where people can interact with Frank Sinatra Enterprises. Do you have personal social media stuff that you don't mind sharing?

 

Charlie: Frank is on social media. I'm not, but there’s franksinatra.com. We have Frank Sinatra on Twitter. So, you can find Frank everywhere on the net. And we are – one of the things we were working on before the crisis hit is we're working on an actual musical based on a time period in Frank's life. That is scheduled to open in London probably in now in 2022 and then we'll come to Broadway. Since Frank passed, we've done various multimedia shows. We've done them in Radio City, we've done them at The Palladium in London and we've done a tour. And that was – we had these huge screens with Frank singing with a live orchestra. But this musical will be the first time that we have anyone actually playing Frank. So, it'll be like a Jersey Boys type musical based on a period in Frank's life. And we're working on that. We're very excited. But you can go to franksinatra.com. You can go to Frank Sinatra on Twitter. Nancy Sinatra also has the Sinatra family website, and anytime anything new comes out, it's always posted on there. And, you know, we have a very active social media following.

 

Lucas: Fantastic. Again, the legacy lives on and grows every single day seemingly. Charlie and Nelson, again, thank you for your time. Thank you for joining us Around the Barrel.

 

Charlie: My pleasure. Thank you for having me.

 

Lucas: Around the Barrel is the official podcast of the Jack Daniel Distillery. Follow the podcast on the web at jackdaniels.com/podcast.

 

If you like what you hear, please subscribe, rate and review at Apple podcasts, Google podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you gather your on-demand audio. Always remember, with great podcasts and great whiskey, please enjoy responsibly. Join us next time for more conversations Around the Barrel.

 

Your friends at Jack Daniel’s remind you to drink responsibly. Jack Daniel’s and Old No. 7 are registered trademarks, Copyright 2020 Jack Daniel’s. Tennessee whiskey, 40% alcohol by volume, 80 proof, distilled and bottled by Jack Daniel Distillery, Lynchburg, Tennessee. Around the Barrel is intended for listeners 21 years of age and older.